Friday, December 13, 2013

[Q&A] Kurt Wiegel (Game Geeks)

[19:04] <+KurtWiegel> Hi all. I'm Kurt Wiegel, half of the Game Geeks production team. We're a YouTube based review show for RPGs. We've been at this for around 10 years (7 or so in YouTube) and just crested over 200 episodes.

[19:04] <&Silverlion> Yay!
[19:04] <+KurtWiegel> We do all kinds of RPGs (although many have accused me of being a Pinnacle Shill) and have a serious "no negative review" policy.
[19:04] <+KurtWiegel> Love the hobby is out motto.
[19:04] <+KurtWiegel> Done
[19:05] <~Dan> Thanks, Kurt! The floor is open to questions!
[19:05] <~Dan> Can you say a bit about how the "no negative review" policy works?
[19:05] <+GenoFoxx> D&D 4th notwithstanding right?
[19:05] <~Dan> Do you read something and tell the author whether you can honestly give a positive review?
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[19:06] <~Dan> (Howdy, MonkofLords!)
[19:06] <+MonkofLords> (Hello)
[19:06] <~Dan> (Q&A in progress, #rpgnet2 open for chat, etc., etc. :) )
[19:06] <+KurtWiegel> If there is a book I don't like at all- and there are very few- I won't review it. The books are labors of love and life for the authors, and I don't want me being in a bad mood or not understanding what they were trying to do to hurt someones feelings or hurt their sales somehow.
[19:07] <+KurtWiegel> Theres someone for everyone, and there are games that speak to everyone.
[19:07] * ~Dan nods
[19:07] <&Silverlion> What is your favorite game that you've reviewed?
[19:07] <+KurtWiegel> I usually don't need to fight for a good review: something is always good in there. I have had to say a few times that I couldn't review it, but I can usually passive aggressive my way out of it.
[19:08] <+KurtWiegel> Silverlion: Hard question- difficult to choose between my children :) I think some of my favorite discoveries have been Savage Worlds and FATE.
[19:09] <+KurtWiegel> The most commented on episode was the 2-part "I hate 4th ed" review that was me having a tantrum.
[19:09] <+Bigby> Hi
[19:09] <+KurtWiegel> I got tired of having people demand a negative review, some implying I wasn't capable of reading something that closely.
[19:09] <+KurtWiegel> Hi Bigby.
[19:10] <~Dan> You kind of just brought this up, but has the "no negative" policy ever caused you any credibility issues in people's minds?
[19:10] <+KurtWiegel> Also- I really liked Hearts and Souls (not pandering to Silver Lion) because it was the first take on supers I'd ever seen that wouldn't degrade to "No, I can lift more).
[19:10] <+KurtWiegel> Plus it was my first comped copy for a review, so it has a special spot in my soul.
[19:10] <+KurtWiegel> done
[19:11] <+GenoFoxx> what's your favorite science-fiction rpg?
[19:11] <+KurtWiegel> Sci Fi: I can give you three: Bulldogs, Fading Suns and Lightspeed
[19:11] <+GenoFoxx> (which you don't do enough reviews of)....hint hint
[19:12] <+KurtWiegel> Bulldogs is Farscape if I've ever seen it, I love Fading Suns so much but I can't ever get something going for it and Lightspeed has the best "Kitchen sink" settings I've ever read. Never cared for Fusion, so I'm always half toying with it for conversions.
[19:12] <+KurtWiegel> done
[19:13] <~Dan> (Did you see my question, Kurt?)
[19:13] <+KurtWiegel> Sorry Dan, no. Please repeat?
[19:13] <~Dan> I asked whether your "no negative" policy has ever caused you any credibility issues in viewers' minds.
[19:14] <+KurtWiegel> Sorry. Yes it has- I have a lot of people (and a few I've worked on the Ennies with) who don't think I'm a real reviewer because I'm like the Bob Ross of RPGs.
[19:15] <+KurtWiegel> I understand their POV, but I don't like rampant negativity that pops up a lot in reviews- I love my hobby and I want to share that.
[19:16] * ~Dan nods
[19:16] <&Silverlion> One of the reasons I try and break down things as explanations in my few past written reviews--I don't like being negative.
[19:16] <~Dan> That can certainly be tricky.
[19:16] <+xyphoid> so is this d&d4 review an actual negative review or not
[19:16] <&Silverlion> Yeah it was Xyphoid...
[19:16] <+Bigby> Now I'm picturing you with a Bob Ross afro...
[19:16] <+KurtWiegel> My main question is "am I entertained in some way." That can be for almost anything, so I'm pretty easy. And most of the people who loge complaints are so negative anyway its toxic.
[19:16] <+MonkofLords> It's an odd image
[19:17] <~Dan> As I've mentioned before, Phil Brucato suggested that I was the cause of Deliria not getting distributed for 1-1/2 years.
[19:17] <+KurtWiegel> I'm glad very few of my college pictures have made it into the internet. Its was there for a while.
[19:18] <+KurtWiegel> The D&D review was a lot of melodrama based on a game that made changes I didn't care for.
[19:18] <~Dan> Do you address whether a game doesn't appeal to you, personally? Or does that fall into the "negative" side?
[19:18] <+xyphoid> do you regret that?
[19:18] <+GenoFoxx> any plans for a 2300AD retrospective?
[19:18] <~Dan> (Question pause.)
[19:18] <+KurtWiegel> And I hate that any game (or author) has suffered.
[19:20] <+KurtWiegel> There are a lot of games that don't appeal to me personally- I don't have the time or energy for rules-heavy things that require me to learn a bunch of rules and sub rules and then have to teach them to people (Spycraft 2.0, I'm looking at you).
[19:20] <+KurtWiegel> I don't regret the D&D 4 review mainly because it got people off my back for the concept of negativity and it wasn't like I was going to hurt their sales at all.
[19:20] <+KurtWiegel> Geno: Sorry- 2300AD?
[19:21] <+GenoFoxx> once known as Traveller:2300
[19:21] <&Silverlion> Its a shame, but I felt the Deleria review was honest...
[19:21] <&Silverlion> Mongoose got the writes and added it to their other Traveler line
[19:22] <+GenoFoxx> it was original produced by Games Designer Workshop, the same people who also did Traveller
[19:22] <+KurtWiegel> Oh. Sorry. Traveller is a game that got by me by and large- sorta like Shadowrun and Exalted- so I can't say much about that. Hard Sci Fi is under represented but thats because I think real science stuff can be dull.
[19:23] <+xyphoid> so if your audiene asked for another negative review, would you do that?
[19:24] <+KurtWiegel> Xyphoid: not likely. I did it once, and I have a few more I could do (Everything is Dolphins for one) but I'm over that now.
[19:24] <+KurtWiegel> Have I missed any?
[19:25] <~Dan> What got you into reviewing, and how did you come up with the Game Geeks format?
[19:25] <~Dan> (I don't think so.)
[19:25] <&Silverlion> How much does each episode "cost" in resources?
[19:26] <+Frankto> Hey, Kurt. I saw you've been at this for a while now, so here's a fairly unorthorox question for you. In the games you've reviewed so far, which game mechanics have you encountered you really like? By that I mean, quirks of a particular system that really work well or made you want to try it out.
[19:26] <+KurtWiegel> Game Geeks existed for a few episodes before me. My producer Rob had filmed two other guys (Jon and Pete) doing other reviews in his game shop. I found it late one night while holding my daughter when she was sick to get her to sell. The first and only time I'd seen Call of Cthulhu on screen.
[19:27] <+KurtWiegel> Here they are: (Link:
[19:27] <+KurtWiegel> I came in a year or so later and did an episode with Pete on AFMBE- it was community access at the time.
[19:28] <+KurtWiegel> We did regular eps for Public access for a few years, then Rob wanted to try YouTube (we were pretty well done by then) and it took off in a way I'd never considered.
[19:29] <+KurtWiegel> The cost is minimal for me- I think it takes Rob a few hours to piece them together and insert the graphics- he has a harder job than I do- then he uploads them.
[19:30] <+KurtWiegel> Its part of why we have so many long breaks: we booth have families, so putting time together can be rough.
[19:30] <&Silverlion> Awesome
[19:31] <+KurtWiegel> Frankto: Good question- I think FATEs aspects are really cool, and I see traces of FATE DNA popping up everywhere these days, and different applications of the Drama Point/Story Point are fun to see. I really like the escalating scale of Cortex (original) the most.
[19:31] <+KurtWiegel> fone
[19:31] <+KurtWiegel> done, dagnabbit
[19:31] <~Dan> Do you need to answer the fone?
[19:32] <+KurtWiegel> No- I just have fat fingers
[19:32] <+CJCarella> Is there any upcoming game you're excited about? Anything good coming out in 2014?
[19:32] <~Dan> :D
[19:32] <+KurtWiegel> for 2014... well, I'm interested to see if beyond dgsrth
[19:33] <+KurtWiegel> Sorry, my dog climbed in my lap- hold on.
[19:33] * ~Dan chuckles
[19:33] <+Frankto> I can't deny that. FATE RPG aspects are probably one of the more clever pieces of game design I've encountered.
[19:33] <+Frankto> It makes character (and world) design that much more interesting.
[19:33] <+KurtWiegel> OK, He's about 100 pounds of loving fury, but not light.
[19:33] <+CJCarella> ok, 'cause I just googled dgsrth and nothing came out. Well, other than porn.
[19:33] * ~Dan laughs
[19:34] <+KurtWiegel> What kind of pro- never mind. Don't want to know.
[19:34] <+CJCarella> :D
[19:35] <+KurtWiegel> I'm interested to see if White Wolf/Obsidian path can really come back or not. If D&D next will work or not (leaning towards no in my opinion) and if Beyond Human will see the light of day.
[19:35] <~Dan> Agreed, re: Beyond Human.
[19:35] <~Dan> Thom tells me he's done with it.
[19:36] <+KurtWiegel> I'm lucky enough to be an Ennies judge, so I get most of the big releases.
[19:36] <+CJCarella> Yeah, the playtest is over, not sure when it's going to be released.
[19:36] <~Dan> He also says it features public domain superheroes like the Black Terror. Which is awesome.
[19:36] <&Silverlion> I'm hoping D&D works....
[19:36] <+KurtWiegel> I don't understand the publishing side of this hobby, so I'll never comment on it but it can be frustrating,
[19:37] <+KurtWiegel> Tremulus from San Preston looks really interesting too, but I think I'll need to digest the book rather than the PDF- I'm a little old fashioned that way.
[19:37] <+CJCarella> Yeah, tell me about it (the publishing side) - main reason I left the biz a few years back.
[19:38] <+KurtWiegel> i could never do it myself.
[19:38] <&Silverlion> Me too Kurt. Me too
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[19:38] <&Silverlion> Very very very frustrating...
[19:38] <~Dan> My attempts to get published have been... underwhelming.
[19:39] <~Dan> Kurt, do you have any thoughts about the general "health" of the hobby?
[19:39] <&egyptian> I will say though, that whatever success has been had in the realm of PDFs and eBooks, for me nothing replaces a flesh-and-blood book.
[19:40] <+KurtWiegel> I agree. Much easier to show people what you did.
[19:40] <&Silverlion> Dan: You could write for me :D *LOL*
[19:41] <~Dan> :D
[19:41] <+xyphoid> have you done a dungeon world review?
[19:41] <~Dan> That's actually not a bad idea... :)
[19:41] <+KurtWiegel> I think the health of the hobby is pretty good- sales go up and down, but there are more books published every year by more companies, more outlets like PDFs and other electronic media. I think its doing OK, but I don't need to make a living off of it.
[19:41] <&Silverlion> Yeah. Making a living on it is rare...
[19:41] <~Dan> Do you see Kickstarter as a big contributer to the hobby these days?
[19:42] <+KurtWiegel> Dungeon World is on my pile, but its slightly tainted by the rampant and unnecessary foulness that was in apocalypse world, so I have trouble getting around that (Barbaren from Vagrant city games has some neat mechanics, but I can't get past crude for crude sakes sometimes).
[19:43] <&Silverlion> YEah, see that's why I avoided Dungeon World, but I like it now...:D
[19:44] <&Silverlion> Its not got the problems of AW....
[19:44] <+KurtWiegel> Kickstarter has changed the face of game production in my opinion. Its the 500 pound gorilla that everyone must acknowledge now. I haven't backed a kickstarted project for a few reasons, but the big ones are (1) I don't have that much disposable income and (2) its like an MMO for me- once I start, I know I could never stop.
[19:44] <~Dan> I hadn't heard about that, re: Apocalypse World. Pretty vulgar?
[19:45] <+KurtWiegel> DW has some pretty slick mechanics.
[19:45] <+KurtWiegel> AW isn't FATAL, but its not something I'd let my kids anywhere near.
[19:45] <&Silverlion> I just hope people will come and support my kickstarter--I like a lot of technical video skills
[19:45] <&Silverlion> Two words: Sex moves
[19:46] <+KurtWiegel> Um... uh... DAN I NEED AN ADULT!
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[19:46] <~Dan> Well, physically I suppose I qualify, at least...
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[19:46] <&Silverlion> Anyway. Yeah. Dungeon World doesn't have that.
[19:46] <&Silverlion> So are there any big games you want to review?
[19:47] <+KurtWiegel> OK Silverlion-if you do a "how-to" Kama Sutra, I'll back it.
[19:47] <+KurtWiegel> Sort of.
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[19:47] <+MonkofLords> (Kama Sutra the RPG?)
[19:47] <+KurtWiegel> For personal pride I'd like to review GURPS, mainly because I've never broken SJG for a copy of anything.
[19:48] <+KurtWiegel> I'd love to do the RIFTS line, but I think theres so much there it'd take forever to digest.
[19:48] <&Silverlion> Hehe.
[19:48] <&Silverlion> Yeah Rifts is SO huge
[19:48] <+KurtWiegel> Plus Palladium can be... prickly from what I understand.
[19:48] <~Dan> Do you only review games for which you get review copies?
[19:49] <+KurtWiegel> I'd love to see a FATE re-launced version of Seven Seas, but I'm dreaming,
[19:49] <&Silverlion> That would be awesome.
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[19:49] <~Dan> Howdy, KJ!
[19:49] <+KurtWiegel> No, I review things I get for my library as well, but I tend towards doing comped copies sooner, mainly because I feel there is more of an obligation there.
[19:49] * ~Dan nods
[19:49] <+KJ> Hey, how's it going folks?
[19:50] <&Silverlion> Allo KJ
[19:50] <&Silverlion> Kurt: Did I ever send you a copy of High Valor?
[19:50] <~Dan> KJ: Going well, thanks! Tonight we're visiting with Kurt Wiegel of Game Geeks.
[19:50] <+KurtWiegel> I don't think so....
[19:50] <+KurtWiegel> Hi KJ
[19:51] <&Silverlion> Well email me the mailing or and I'll send you one
[19:51] <+KurtWiegel> Will do. Thanks.
[19:53] <~Dan> Are there any sorts of mechanics in games that immediately turn you off, or at least strongly bias you against a game?
[19:54] <+KurtWiegel> A few: I LOATHE games that require weird proprietary dice- those that can be used for one game and one alone. And that you need to buy more sets of to effectively play.
[19:55] <+KurtWiegel> I know thats a weird thing to say for someone regularly rolls d10s, but it smacks of rampant money making to me.
[19:56] <+KurtWiegel> Which set off "Enniesgate 2013" last summer too.
[19:56] <~Dan> What was that about?
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[19:57] <+KurtWiegel> Someone in the Ennies leaked "inside information" to a blogger who proceeded to make a really big deal about it. People dog piled on both sides and it blew up. Things I had said were mentioned twice- which doesn't bother me in the slightest- but a lot of people took that opportunity to
[19:58] <+KurtWiegel> air out their grievances withe the process (and sour grapes about not getting nominated/voted in) and just be trolls. Some people in the envies took it personally and it was a pretty ugly scene for a few weeks.
[19:59] <&Silverlion> One of the reasons my friends agreed not to try the new Star Wars.
[19:59] <+KurtWiegel> We have some new... guidelines on what we can say publicly now, which are just statements of what should be common sense in my opinion.
[19:59] <+KurtWiegel> It stops short of a gag order, but an NDA may be in places next year.
[19:59] <+Bigby> The blogger actually made the claim that the only reason Star Wars didn't win something was that one judge hated it due to the dice and fought until it lost.  Other judges in comment section pointed out that it wasn't true.
[20:00] <+KurtWiegel> SilverLion: give that man a cigar.
[20:00] <+Bigby> Not sure if the blogger was looking to cause trouble or if the judge leaking info was trying to cause trouble.
[20:00] <&Silverlion> Hrms.Why I was resistant to Fudge and Fate...
[20:00] <&Silverlion> But there is enough Fate out there now
[20:01] <+KurtWiegel> I think the blogger was looking to stir the pot and get attention. And it worked, but I think it cost him some credibility.
[20:01] <&Silverlion> Hrms. I don't recall that, but I was busy :D
[20:01] <+KurtWiegel> FATE dice are an exception to my rule, and so are the HEX dice, but I was sent those.
[20:02] <+KurtWiegel> The thing that bugged me was former judges who attacked the rest of us for what we "didn't do right." He was also friends with the head guy at the time, so it got weirdly personal in there.
[20:02] <&Silverlion> Nice thing about Hex is the dice aren't needed
[20:02] <+KurtWiegel> Absolutley.
[20:03] <+KurtWiegel> but neither are FATE/FUDGE dice
[20:03] <&egyptian> My issue with Star Wars's proprietary dice wasn't that the game used them, but that they could have been designed better. The symbols were pretty, but not intuitive. FATE dice instantly make sense to anybody.
[20:03] <+KurtWiegel> I like the Starblazer d6-d6
[20:04] <+KurtWiegel> Yeah- I think they'll submit the full game this year for the Ennies so we'll see what happens then.
[20:05] <&Silverlion> Yeah Egyptian, my friend had that problem
[20:06] <+KurtWiegel> I have one for everyone: whats your favorite music/soundtrack for gaming?
[20:06] <&egyptian> Soundtrack from Dune (the 1984 movie)
[20:06] <~Dan> Hmm. I like the Conan theme and the Escape from New York theme.
[20:06] <&Silverlion> I use Two Steps from Hell soundtracks for some
[20:07] <~Dan> Oh... and Vultan's Theme from "Flash Gordon".
[20:07] <+KurtWiegel> Elliot Goldenthal's Final Fantasy Spirits within for me.
[20:07] <+GenoFoxx> Gordon's ALIVE?
[20:07] <~Dan> And you can't beat the Indiana Jones theme for pulpy traveling music.
[20:08] <+KurtWiegel> DIIIIIIVE!!!
[20:08] <+KurtWiegel> God you can't beat Brian Blessed's overacting.
[20:08] <~Dan> I used Vultan's Theme for a HEX game featuring battling airships and rocket Nazis.
[20:09] <&egyptian> I like the Dune soundtrack because it's space-y and atmospheric, but doesn't have a super-strong association to the source material. The Star Wars soundtracks are great, but who can play D&D with that playing in the background? All you can think of is Han dodging asteroids.
[20:09] <+JP> egyptian, the orchestral stuff on Lynch's Dune is amazing
[20:10] <~Dan> Oh, and how could I forget "O Fortuna"?
[20:10] <+KurtWiegel> I like the Dune miniseries soundtrack myself for similar reasons. Summon the worms is my ringtone, alternating with TORCHWOOD
[20:10] <+CJCarella> I'm a barbarian who doesn't play music while gaming - it's all words and rolling dice - maybe hum something if it's appropriate :)
[20:10] <~Dan> :)
[20:10] <&Silverlion> I don't often use music but sometimes
[20:10] <&egyptian> Shostakovich is also very good. Heavy parts, soft parts...
[20:11] <+GenoFoxx> He is the Quisatch Haderach
[20:11] <+KurtWiegel> I had a player a few years ago who was a gifted musician. He'd put together scores for each game he'd run for us. Brilliant stuff.
[20:12] <~Dan> How often do you get to play, Kurt?
[20:13] <+KurtWiegel> Weekly mostly. Once in a while we'll need to miss but its weekly. I'm very lucky that way.
[20:13] <~Dan> What are you currently playing?
[20:13] <+Bigby> Starting in January I will be running Tephra per Kurt's request.
[20:14] <+KurtWiegel> Heh. Good question. Right now I'm doing horror one shots, then in the new year my players are...
[20:15] <+Bigby> (unless he changed his mind...)
[20:15] <+KurtWiegel> yep, thanks Bigby. He's doing Tephra (a really cool stamping fantasy game- I'll let him describe it), one is doing the CAMELOT-TRIGGER from FATE Worlds in Shadow and another is doing a Rise of the Guardians game.
[20:15] <+Bigby> Who is running Camelot-Trigger?
[20:15] <&Silverlion> Is Tephra the Steam punk game?
[20:15] <~Dan> No need to describe it. It's sitting right here, and I did a Q&A with the author. :)
[20:15] <+KurtWiegel> I'm very lucky my players are willing to do this.
[20:16] <+Bigby> Silverlion, yup, that's the one.
[20:16] <~Dan> I'm not familiar with Camelot-Trigger, though. What's that?
[20:16] <+KurtWiegel> Jordan
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[20:16] <&Silverlion> Arthuruan Mecha game...
[20:17] <+KurtWiegel> Camelot trigger is a far-future mechs game in our solar system retelling the Arthurian myths through space knights and fantasy sic fi
[20:17] <~Dan> So it has magic involved?
[20:17] <+KurtWiegel> I'm angling to play Bedevere, Arthur's magnificent ba$tard
[20:18] <+KurtWiegel> No magic really, unless the GM decides to weld some on. Discussions have pointed to he's going to do some really epic stuff.
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[20:18] <~Dan> (Howdy, Squide!)
[20:19] <&Le_Squide> (Hey Dan!)
[20:19] <+KurtWiegel> Tephra is a lot of fun and very interesting.
[20:19] <~Dan> The system seems a little complex.
[20:20] <+KurtWiegel> Bigby broke it down well for is.
[20:20] <+KurtWiegel> us.
[20:20] <+Bigby> It's complexity is mostly front-loaded into character creation (which I took care of) due to all the "specialty" options.
[20:20] <+KurtWiegel> I'll say it DESPERATELY needs some kind of bennie or drama point mechanic though.
[20:21] <+Bigby> I'm currently having some issues with the publishers, but I'm running with it.
[20:21] <+Bigby> I'll think about it.
[20:21] <+KurtWiegel> Its your game.
[20:21] <+KurtWiegel> What did people thing of Wolsung?
[20:21] <+KurtWiegel> think. Dang it
[20:21] <&Silverlion> People tried to suggest Tephra to me in Lubbock
[20:22] <~Dan> I know something about the mechanics of Wolsung turned me off big-time. I forget the specifics.
[20:22] <+KurtWiegel> It was a weird composite of cards and dice.
[20:22] <~Dan> I don't think it was that...
[20:23] <+Bigby> I was just reading a thread about whether or not Wolsung was racist.  Actually kind of made me want to take a look at it just to form my own opinion...
[20:23] <&Silverlion> I don't know. I'm looking forward to Clockwork Empire
[20:23] <+Bigby> Me too!
[20:23] <~Dan> That one looks pretty good.
[20:23] <+KurtWiegel> Um. I never thought is it that way, but I'll look.
[20:24] <~Dan> And the authors are great guys.
[20:25] <~Dan> (brb)
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[20:25] <+KurtWiegel> I'm hoping Tephra makes me understand Steampunk.
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[20:25] * +Sigh waves to the room.
[20:26] <+Bigby> I should run Widening Gyre for that Kurt, since it is actually Victorian ("traditional") steampunk.
[20:26] <+Bigby> So, I know the big question really on everyone's mind.  Kurt, who's your favorite player?
[20:26] <+Bigby> :p
[20:27] <+KurtWiegel> My favorite player- now or ever?
[20:27] <&Silverlion> What's your favorite character?
[20:27] <+KurtWiegel> Well, all I'll say is he's a Ginger....
[20:27] <+Bigby> Oh ha ha.
[20:27] <+KurtWiegel> That I played or has been played at my table?
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[20:28] <+Bigby> For everyone else our current group is two full gingers and a couple of day-walkers.
[20:28] <+KurtWiegel> To explain the joke- three of the four players at my table are redheads.
[20:28] <+KurtWiegel> Jinx- buy me a coke
[20:28] <+GenoFoxx> where can I get a copy of Camelot-Trigger?
[20:28] <+Bigby> Anyway, my question was a joke as well.
[20:28] <~Dan> Ah. Heh. :)
[20:28] <+KurtWiegel> Its in FATE- Worlds in Shadow as one of the example worlds
[20:28] <+KurtWiegel> whats the jaywalker?
[20:28] <+KurtWiegel> daywalker!
[20:29] * ~Dan waves to Sigh!
[20:29] <+KurtWiegel> Hi Sigh
[20:29] <&Silverlion> Hi Sigh.
[20:29] <+Bigby> I'll explain later Kurt...
[20:30] <+Bigby> So, anyone have any real questions?  I don't want to waste everyone's time.
[20:30] <+KurtWiegel> Sorry- I'm easily distracted.
[20:30] <~Dan> Kurt: Do you have a favorite genre?
[20:31] <+KurtWiegel> Modern horror/magic. Urban fantasy
[20:32] <+KurtWiegel> Part of the reason I love the unisystem games so much
[20:32] <+CJCarella> :)
[20:32] <+Bigby> We play a fair bit of Cinematic Unisystem using the 2d6 varient.
[20:32] <&Silverlion>
[20:32] <+KurtWiegel> Sorry- I wasn't fishing there or anything there.
[20:33] <+KurtWiegel> I like the triangular distribution the 2d6 mechanic gives.
[20:33] <+KurtWiegel> I debated 3d6, but I thought that'd be too much work.
[20:33] <+KurtWiegel> Question for the group- a game you should LOVE but theres something you jet can't get about it?
[20:33] <+Bigby> You'll get 3d6 when I eventually run more Hero
[20:33] <+DulothX> Too much work?
[20:34] <+KurtWiegel> Mine: Smallvbille Cortex+
[20:34] <~Dan> Hmm. Depends upon what you mean by "should" love.
[20:35] <+KurtWiegel> 3d6+ 2 sets of numbers might slow down some of the gameplay
[20:35] <+KurtWiegel> Seems like something that'd be right up your alley but doesn't sit right.
[20:35] <~Dan> Hmm... That's a good question.
[20:36] <~Dan> Well... I suppose Marvel Cortex+ in my case, insofar as I love Marvel, but I cannot abide the system.
[20:36] <&Silverlion> Me either...
[20:37] <+KurtWiegel> I really like Cortex Classic once one can get past the damage weirdness, but I just don't get +. And, making characters for Smallville is like designing the small Hadron collider
[20:37] <~Dan> Same goes for Spirit of the Century, I suppose.
[20:38] <&Silverlion> I like SOTC...:D
[20:38] <+CJCarella> I mostly strip other games for parts and convert them to what I run, so I guess that's all of them :P
[20:38] * ~Dan chuckles
[20:39] <+KurtWiegel> PREACH.
[20:39] * ~Dan imagines CJ sitting in the middle of a junkyard of stripped-down games, tinkering like a mad inventor.
[20:39] <&Silverlion> Lots of people do that.
[20:39] <+CJCarella> Of course, I'm woefully behind in the current gaming state of the art - haven't bought a new game since last decade...
[20:40] <+KurtWiegel> YEah, but the image is great.
[20:40] <+CJCarella> Or maybe the decade before that.
[20:40] <~Dan> Perhaps, but I do have it on good authority that you are, at least, gaming, CJ. ;)
[20:40] <+Yalborap> Kurt: I'd suggest looking at the Leverage version of Cortex+, or the Hacker's Guide. I found the game a lot easier to parse with the generic version in the HG.
[20:40] <+JP> I don't think implying gaming is like a technology, using "state of the art" is an applicable metaphor.
[20:40] <+JP> IMHO
[20:41] <+Yalborap> As for games I've found that didn't quite work...Exalted. Far, far, far, /far/ too crunchy.
[20:41] <&Silverlion> Leverage is closer to original
[20:41] <+KurtWiegel> oh yeah. Exalted is a framing nightmare of a game.
[20:41] <+CJCarella> That depends on whether or not gaming has evolved from its beginnings, and whether or not it has continued to evolve.
[20:42] <+CJCarella> I'd definitely say that's true on the first part of the statement, at least.
[20:42] <&Silverlion> I still play Star "new" isn't always better
[20:43] <+Yalborap> I can't think of a single game I like that's older than 5 or 6 years old, and most of those are either for their setting or have since come out with a revised game that cleans it up.
[20:43] <+CJCarella> When I went to some gaming forums to promote the Armageddon Girl/New Olympus Kickstater, I got a lot of "gaming has changed a lot since the 1990s" comments.
[20:43] <+JP> I feel the only advance we have made is that we have rules now for how GMs play, instead of relying on "magical gamemastering skill" which could only be learned by watching.
[20:43] <&Silverlion> JP:
[20:44] <+KurtWiegel> I think a lot of games now are codifying things that decent GMs have been doing for years- like GUMSHOE.
[20:44] <&Silverlion> I like tools.
[20:44] <+CJCarella> Well, I think there's been a lot of significant changes from the original, wargaming bastard child that D&D originally was.
[20:44] <+xyphoid> personally i love the advances we're seeing
[20:44] <+KurtWiegel> I'm always learning on how to be a better GM. (Cue Bigby)
[20:45] <+xyphoid> a lot of it's totally applicable to me running older games
[20:45] <+Bigby> Huh, what?
[20:45] <+Bigby> Kurt is the best GM I've had.  He has made leaps and bounds since I first joined the group. :)
[20:45] <~Dan> I guess the tech comparison is a bit tricky, insofar as it suggests advancements toward the "right" way to game.
[20:46] <+KurtWiegel> Thanks Bigby. Your check is in the mail....
[20:46] <~Dan> There have been changes and evolution going on, certainly.
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[20:47] <+Bigby> Well, I've had some pretty bad GMs as well, lol
[20:47] <+MonkofLords> Haven't we all?
[20:47] <+xyphoid> yeah, people get offended at the terminology as if saying 'X is an advance' means that you're a worse person for running something without it
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[20:47] <+CJCarella> Now, considering a lot of "obsolete" games still continue to outsell a good percentage of the more "evolved" games, I find the whole thing amusing.
[20:47] <+JP> Bigby, well that is part of the broken culture propagated by D&D, as I see it.
[20:47] <+JP> re: bad GMs
[20:48] <+CJCarella> Which is why I'm using "state of the art" mostly tongue-in-cheek, but still have seen a lot of changes over time.
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[20:49] * ~Dan nods
[20:49] <+Bigby> I've played fun D&D games (though not many) and I've had bad GMs run things not remotely similar to D&D.  I hardly think it is fair to blame one game for the huge number of maladjusted people out there trying to GM.
[20:49] <+JP> CJ, for sure. I was just making sure we didn't mean to imply some kind of technology comparison :)
[20:49] <&Silverlion> I think the problem is that the Gm's role is social, highly social.
[20:50] <+JP> Bigby, I think its reasonable to do so, since its a cultural icon not unlike say CoC. Not that I want to argue the point at length.
[20:50] <+CJCarella> Tech-wise, it's still a bunch of people sitting on a table using polyhedral random-number generators, pencils and paper :D
[20:50] <&Silverlion> and a lot of people don't realize that takes certain skills...heck I took storytelling classes (speech communication/education credit) and learned a lot.
[20:50] <~Dan> I see it more akin to music, with branches going off in all directions. Or, more specifically, rock and roll, with the developments leading people to categorize some variations as not rock music anymore at all. :)
[20:50] <+JP> Dan, that feels apt
[20:51] <+CJCarella> although I guess now tablets and mobile devices are playing an increasing role.
[20:51] <+CJCarella> yeah, music and RPGs are both creative endeavors.
[20:51] <+xyphoid> yeah, my EP game had 3 laptops and 3 tablets at the table usually
[20:51] <*Billy_Joel*> It's all rocks fall and everybody dies to me.
[20:51] <+KurtWiegel> I use my tablets for music mainly, or if a picture needs to be seen quickly, but I'm about to loose it. Its very distracting for me.
[20:51] <+JP> Nobody want to hear from the Innocent Man :P
[20:52] <~Dan> I'd say technology has impacted my gaming powerfully, insofar as I only play via IRC these days. :)
[20:52] <~Dan> And probably wouldn't be gaming at all otherwise.
[20:52] <+JP> Kurt, I'm so thick into tech that it bores me. When I bring a tablet to gaming its mostly in power saving, even if my character sheet is a PDF on it :P
[20:53] <+CJCarella> And you need both a good GM and good players - a good gaming group can make just about any system fun.
[20:53] <+JP> IRC is kind of ancient by today's standards. I'm often surprised there is no clear modern replacement.
[20:53] * +JP nods sagely to CJ
[20:53] <~Dan> That's true. More than once, I've been very skeptical about a game only to have a great GM change my mind.
[20:54] <~Dan> Tribe 8 comes immediately to mind.
[20:54] <+Bigby> We have good players... Well, adequate players...  Well, no one's killed anyone yet...
[20:54] <&Bill> There is.  Facebook, and Twitter, and Google+, and...
[20:54] <+KurtWiegel> I have a really good group now- probably the best composite group I've ever had.
[20:54] <+JP> That is one knock against convention play, since you have no control of who will be playing and such.
[20:54] <+Serami> IRC? It still works because it's ubiquitous!
[20:54] <+Serami> It's just like email - easy to set up, easy to use, easy to perpetuate
[20:54] <&Bill> exactly.
[20:54] <+JP> heh
[20:54] <+Serami> If there's no clear need for an improvement there is rarely a market for an improvement to flourish!
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[20:55] <+Serami> A modern model only works if there's enough impetus to overcome inertia~
[20:55] <&Bill> No proprietary format preventing people from doing their own thing with it.
[20:55] <+KurtWiegel> I'd like to add here that Dan's review of Demon Hunters and DH2 Dead Camper Lake got me into that entire series and the game. Best description of how the movie felt I've ever read (serious game tangented by a joke that was GOOD)
[20:55] <+JP> Serami, support for simple univsersal standards like unicode and images? :P
[20:55] <&Bill> And no proprietary format preventing people from doing _anything_ with it when (not if) the owners shut it down.
[20:55] <~Dan> Thanks, Kurt! :)
[20:55] <+xyphoid> irc has the real advantage that it looks like work
[20:55] <&Bill> That too.  :p
[20:56] <+xyphoid> i have like 6 shells open at the moment, 5 are work, 1 is irssi
[20:56] <+JP> shells? who does that these days. Windows! :P
[20:56] <&Bill> ICQ had a group chat function, AIM did, yahoo chat did, etc.
[20:56] <+KurtWiegel> I've just converted to all Mac.
[20:56] <+JP> group chat isn't really IRC
[20:57] <+KurtWiegel> Thats all I can contribute to a tech discussion.
[20:57] <+xyphoid> google hangouts are pretty amazing for a game though
[20:57] <+Serami> JP: Mibbit supports images! And a lot of clients support or use Unicode, though it leads to some disparity between what someone might type and what someone might see
[20:57] <+JP> XMPP has come closest IMO with conference rooms
[20:58] <+JP> Serami, Mibbit is the web-based IRC right?
[20:59] <+KurtWiegel> CJ: whats your favorite part of the Witchcraft Armageddon setting?
[20:59] <+JP> Kurt, don't worry, I won't hold that against you :)
[21:00] <~Dan> Quick note: While the official Q&A is over at the top of the hour, you're free to hang out with us and chat as long as you like, Kurt. :)
[21:00] <+KurtWiegel> Thanks Dan. I may just.
[21:00] <+KurtWiegel> This has been a lot of fun.
[21:00] <+CJCarella> Well, I'm partial to the pagan deities myself.
[21:00] <&Silverlion> Heh.
[21:00] <~Dan> Good! You should come by more often, Kurt. :)
[21:01] <+CJCarella> And that I got to mix and match every darn urban fantasy element I could think of.
[21:01] <+CJCarella> Although I wish I'd gotten to do Faerie stuff.
[21:01] <~Dan> Yeah, that would have been cool.
[21:01] <&Silverlion> That would have been cool
[21:01] * ~Dan high-fives Sil. :)
[21:02] <~Dan> The world of the dead stuff looked awesome as well.
[21:02] <+KurtWiegel> I agree, but I'm almost Faeried out these days, with the Dresden emphasis. I'd have loved to see your POV CJ
[21:02] <+Bigby> I'm one of those weird people who is getting tired of "fey" being in every fantasy/urban-fantasy setting.
[21:02] <+CJCarella> I had some in Mystery Codex, but Eden cut it out for space reasons, and it didn't make it anywhere else.
[21:02] <+Bigby> (I blame you Kurt.)
[21:03] <+KurtWiegel> The book of Geburah is often in my "I found it" dreams.
[21:03] <+MonkofLords> Srs
[21:03] <+CJCarella> Well, this was many years ago, of course :)
[21:03] <+KurtWiegel> I agree Bigby.
[21:03] <+KurtWiegel> So... Spill CJ. Don't be a tease....
[21:03] <+CJCarella> There's been a lot of Fey overload since then.
[21:04] <+CJCarella> Well, there were a bunch of different Sidhe races, although the "dwarves" were going to be Neanderthals that had made it to the Fey realms and survived the great extinctions.
[21:05] <~Dan> CJCarella: That's weird, CJ... The Everlasting's dwarves were Neanderthals as well.
[21:05] <~Dan> Which I thought was cool.
[21:05] <&Silverlion> I'd have made them fey
[21:05] <+KurtWiegel> I'm thinking of my next game being an extended WC/Armageddon game shaped like American Horror Story: each "season" would center on a different group of the supernatural- Wizards, then ghosts and necromancers, psychics and the Combine, angels and demons etc.
[21:05] <+CJCarella> lol - not surprised.
[21:06] <+CJCarella> (about other people using Neanderthals as dwarves)
[21:06] <+KurtWiegel> Everything is Fey- next from the makers of Everything is Dolphins....
[21:06] <+CJCarella> That sounds cool.
[21:06] <~Dan> I wonder whatever happened to the guy who wrote The Everlasting... He's a cool guy.
[21:07] <+CJCarella> concentrating on each subset of supernaturals, that is.
[21:07] <&Silverlion> No idea
[21:07] <+MonkofLords> Bored...
[21:07] <+Sigh> Monk:  Develop an under water adventure manual.
[21:08] <+Bigby> Why would you want to use an adventure manual under water?
[21:08] <+MonkofLords> Yeah, seems like a bad idea.
[21:08] <+xyphoid> dolphins and dugongs
[21:08] * +GenoFoxx golfclaps
[21:09] <+MonkofLords> 1/10
[21:09] <+KurtWiegel> Visionary studios website was last updated in 2008 but its still there.
[21:09] <+Bigby> Sorry.  It's one of those nights.  I'm getting a bit punchy.
[21:09] <+GenoFoxx> well where else would you use an underwater adventuring manual in a desert?
[21:10] <&Silverlion> I need a website update
[21:10] <~Dan> Actually, I always loved the fact that WitchCraft/Armageddon just went nuts with the various supernaturals. Focussing on one type seems to miss the point, IMO.
[21:11] <+KurtWiegel> Underwater adventure manual- Blue Planet. Why did I mis that one?
[21:11] <+Crazy-Cabal> Well Armageddon kind of blew the gates off the hinges.
[21:11] <+KurtWiegel> Yeah, Leviathan will do that. And not bring cake.
[21:12] <&Silverlion> I wish we could get a far future post-Armageddon resolutions Urban/Fantasy Sci fi game using Unisystem :D
[21:12] <+CJCarella> No right way to play the setting - I'm going to be running an all-Atlantean game when my current game is over.
[21:12] <+GenoFoxx> ah first edition Blue Planet that brings back memories
[21:14] <~Dan> CJ: Did you mean for... what are the specially-bred Immortal warriors? Shetarri?
[21:14] <+CJCarella> after the Leviathan thing was resolved (assuming it didn't end in "And Then Everyone Died") would probably be fairly Mad-Max like...
[21:14] <+Sigh> SilverLion: Is that a general statement to let us know that you'll be making an up-date?
[21:14] <+KurtWiegel> I was doing Farscape in my head the other day and I realized that Stark was a Necromancer.
[21:15] <+CJCarella> Shetarri or something like that.
[21:15] <+GenoFoxx> heh
[21:15] <+GenoFoxx> wouldn't be more a spirit medium?
[21:15] <~Dan> CJ: Did you mean for them to be some of the toughest critters in the setting?
[21:16] <+CJCarella> They were meant to be pretty tanky, although in my games they usually faceplant fairly quickly,
[21:16] <+GenoFoxx> sort of how the biosensor in Universal Century Gundam allows newtypes to talk to the departed
[21:17] <~Dan> Really? In the game I ran, the Shetarri and the demon were the tag-team heavy hitters.
[21:17] <+KurtWiegel> Spirit medium- thats the name. thanks.
[21:18] <+GenoFoxx> and now I wonder if KurtWiegel has even watched Zeta Gundam
[21:18] <+CJCarella> Depends on the point levels and the opposition, I guess. An Inheritor or Avatar should be able to run circles around a Shetarri, depending on what Aspects they picked up.
[21:18] <~Dan> Although the Chow Yun Fat-like son of Hermes was pretty fun, too. :)
[21:18] <+KurtWiegel> Was there ever any more backstory to what happened in Atlantis/Athal in the final days of the war?
[21:18] <+MonkofLords> Gundam eh?
[21:18] <+KurtWiegel> Never watched any Gundam, and minimal anime really.
[21:18] <+MonkofLords> Best Gundam is G Gundam, obviously
[21:18] <+GenoFoxx> :O
[21:19] <+Yalborap> Monk is correct.
[21:19] <+CJCarella> Some - Athal had entered a period of decay at the time, kinda like Melnibone on acid.
[21:19] <+MonkofLords> Burning Finger forever
[21:19] <+GenoFoxx> if you want your Dragonball Z mixed with mecha
[21:19] <+MonkofLords> And terrible stereotypes
[21:19] <+Yalborap> This hand of mine glows with an awesome power!
[21:19] <+MonkofLords> Tequila Gundam forever
[21:19] <+Yalborap> Terrible, amazing stereotypes.
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[21:20] <+Yalborap> The American Gundam Maxter, which is a football player on a surfboard who turns into a boxer.
[21:20] <+MonkofLords> Complete with Poncho, metal stache, and sombrero
[21:20] <&Silverlion> Heh.
[21:20] <+GenoFoxx> I'm more a traditional Gundam fanatic
[21:21] <+KurtWiegel> when I was in college (before I read WC) I had this dream about the last days of atlantis and the story of the warriors who defended it, one betrayed them to the evil outer darkness and destroyed the civilization and then it took forever for the souls to be reborn again.
[21:21] <+CJCarella> Nice.
[21:21] <+KurtWiegel> I had massive deja vu when I read Armageddon
[21:21] <+KurtWiegel> I tied it right into Highlander too, but that as my obsession at the time.
[21:22] <+GenoFoxx> I thought Atlantis took off and headed for another galaxy in it's final days
[21:22] <+MonkofLords> Yeah, no one likes G Gundam because it's good. But because it's AWFUL in the best way possible
[21:22] <+GenoFoxx> oh wait that was Stargate Atlantis
[21:22] <+MonkofLords> When the only not racist gundam is Russia, something is off
[21:22] <+Yalborap> I think it's good.
[21:23] <+Yalborap> Just...You know. /Really/ stereotyped.
[21:23] <+Bigby> Well, I gotta get back to work.
[21:23] <+MonkofLords> Compared to the others, the Russian Gundam was so...basic
[21:23] <+CJCarella> Yeah - the Immortals were my take on Highlander, without the mandatory beheadings and the unmentionable second movie.
[21:23] <+Bigby> See you guys around.
[21:23] <+KurtWiegel> The only stargate I ever liked was Universe
[21:23] <+GenoFoxx> :O
[21:23] <+KurtWiegel> I liked the Immortals worked together instead of preyed on one another.
[21:23] <+Bigby> And good time to leave considering Kurt's last comment...
[21:23] <+Bigby> See ya.
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[21:24] <+CJCarella> See ya Bigby.
[21:24] <+KurtWiegel> Night Biogby. Don;t be a stranger
[21:24] <+GenoFoxx> SGU mixing BSG with Stargate.....not a bad combo but not the best execution either
[21:25] <+GenoFoxx> SGU was so depressing in comparison to the other two Stargate series
[21:25] <+KurtWiegel> I got one last one for CJ before I go: what was the endgame for Armageddon?
[21:26] <+CJCarella> I didn't write a definitive one - it was supposed to be character-driven.
[21:26] <+KurtWiegel> OK, but in your mind?
[21:26] <+KurtWiegel> Did you have an end?
[21:26] <+CJCarella> I would have done a campaign book where the PCs would be central to the story.
[21:26] <+CJCarella> In my mind, Leviathan gets defeated and humanity moves on to become Something Else.
[21:27] <&Silverlion> Transcends things..
[21:27] <+CJCarella> More or less.
[21:27] <+KurtWiegel> Finds the creator?
[21:28] <+CJCarella> It would have been more like humanity grows to become the creator.
[21:28] <+KurtWiegel> Nice. Thanks CJ
[21:29] <+CJCarella> But I'm a sucker for happy endings :)
[21:29] <+CJCarella> And on that note, I bid you all good night. This was fun, great Q&A, Kurt.
[21:29] <+KurtWiegel> And on that note night all. Thanks again: this was a great time.
[21:29] <+KurtWiegel> Night all.
[21:29] <+GenoFoxx> then has to fight the shadows and the Vorlons....oh wait Bablyon 5
[21:29] <+KurtWiegel> Done
[21:29] <+CJCarella> Night, y'all.
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[21:29] <&Silverlion> Mogjt CK
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[21:29] <&Silverlion> CJ
[21:29] <+GenoFoxx> g'night
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[21:39] <~Dan> Welcome to #rpgnet, GamerBoy!
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[21:39] <+MonkofLords> yup
[21:41] <&Silverlion> Anyway..
[21:41] <+MonkofLords> How's life lion?
[21:41] <+GenoFoxx> g'night everyone
[21:41] <+Sigh> Good night, Geno!
[21:42] <+MonkofLords> Night Foxx
[21:42] <&Silverlion> Night Genofoxx.
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[21:42] <&Silverlion> I'm here. Goodish mood again
[21:42] <+MonkofLords> That's good
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[21:44] <+Sigh> Time for me to hop off also...
[21:44] <~Dan> Sleep well, Sigh!
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[21:45] <+Sigh> Thank you very much, Dan.
[21:45] <+MonkofLords> Oi Nick
[21:45] <~Dan> Howdy, nick3!
[21:45] <+nick3> hey everyone
[21:45] <&Silverlion> Jey nick
[21:45] <+MonkofLords> Sup?
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[21:48] <+nick3> not much , doing some employment seeking stuff , and trying to figure how to trigger the War of Illusion story in Fallen London
[21:48] <+MonkofLords> That game is helluva complex
[21:50] <+nick3> It is which is kind of cool ,but I like to know how to trigger that story thread
[21:51] <+MonkofLords> Yeah
[21:53] <+xyphoid> nick3: you start it off in the flit
[21:53] <+xyphoid> once you get to shadowy 85 or so a bunch of stuff with cats and bats shows up
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[21:53] <+xyphoid> (i started it yesterday)
[21:55] <+nick3> Thanks Xy
[21:55] <+MonkofLords> Nice
[21:57] <+Yalborap> Woo, another episode of the WIW log done.
[21:58] <+BlasterKyubey210> wiw?
[21:58] <+xyphoid> december has been great for fallen london, i will probably manage 100 in everything before the end
[21:58] <+MonkofLords> WIW?
[21:58] <+Snoof> Where I Watch.
[21:58] <+BlasterKyubey210> oh
[21:59] <+Snoof> Commentary/review of a TV series, usually.
[22:00] <+MonkofLords> I see
[22:00] <+Yalborap> What they said.
[22:01] <&Silverlion> I don't have the patience to write a WIW
[22:01] <&Silverlion> or WIR
[22:01] <+Yalborap> I'm currently doing a lot of anime, with the latest one being the very long-titled Stella Women's Academy, High School Division Class C3. Which is basically like Girls und Panzer without the tanks.
[22:01] <+Snoof> So it's just Girls?
[22:01] <+Yalborap> Silver: I started doing them to learn patience and to stick with something.
[22:01] <+Yalborap> With airsoft guns.
[22:01] <+Yalborap> Playing survival games.
[22:02] <~Dan> I'm out for the night. Bye, folks!
[22:02] <&Silverlion> Night Dan

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